The death of the cruise?

spokey · Post by **spokey** » Sun 08 Mar, 2009 15:34

I can't see cruises being worth doing any more if this law comes in:

THE government is to cut the national speed limit from 60mph to 50mph on most of Britain’s roads, enforced by a new generation of average speed cameras.

The reduction , to be imposed as early as next year, will affect two thirds of the country’s road network.

It will certainly be the end of my love affair with the British road.

What is wrong with this government? Why do they hate mostorists so much?

TrickyZ1 · Post by **TrickyZ1** » Sun 08 Mar, 2009 15:36

All the more reason to do more cruises this year

TonyCal · Post by **TonyCal** » Sun 08 Mar, 2009 15:44

Maybe its an excuse to add to the number of revenue producing speed cameras.

spokey · Post by **spokey** » Sun 08 Mar, 2009 16:24

TrickyZ1 wrote:

All the more reason to do more cruises this year

Damn tooting.

Bastards. I'm NOT taking this lying down.

Titan · Post by **Titan** » Sun 08 Mar, 2009 16:25

spokey wrote:......50mph on most of Britain’s roads, enforced by a new generation of average speed cameras. ....The reduction , to be imposed as early as next year, will affect two
thirds of the country’s road network.

Cheer up Spokey....don't cry

It's not that bad
6 miles is a very fine grid of cameras to be installed across even two thirds of the country.
Think of all the remote spots that don't have electricity supplies or communications cables.
Installing cameras there will be either impossible or prohibitively expensive

An interesting strategy may be to devise a cruise route that doesn't cross any such zones or perhaps works entirely WITHIN one. Your average speed through a zone could be very low - especially if you turn round inside it and then drive a little bit faster....

Regards
Titan

Ian_C · Post by **Ian_C** » Sun 08 Mar, 2009 16:26

Titan wrote:
An interesting strategy may be to devise a cruise route that doesn't cross any such zones or perhaps works entirely WITHIN one. Your average speed through a zone could be very low - especially if you turn round inside it and then drive a little bit faster....

...that's more than interesting, it's genius!

Titan · Post by **Titan** » Sun 08 Mar, 2009 16:51

My concern is not so much the local cameras but the national interchange of data.
Who knows how may times a day our number plates are checked and recorded? Once you have been observed at Point A at Time 1, it doesnt take a genius to work out your average speed to the next observation at Point B at Time 2.
Extrapolate this such that A is eg Edinburgh and B is eg London. All the ANPR is via the PNC so woe and betide anyone who does more than 70 on the motorway......

spokey · Post by **spokey** » Sun 08 Mar, 2009 17:57

Titan wrote:
spokey wrote:......50mph on most of Britain’s roads, enforced by a new generation of average speed cameras. ....The reduction , to be imposed as early as next year, will affect two
thirds of the country’s road network.
Cheer up Spokey....don't cry

It's not that bad
6 miles is a very fine grid of cameras to be installed across even two thirds of the country.
Think of all the remote spots that don't have electricity supplies or communications cables.
Installing cameras there will be either impossible or prohibitively expensive

An interesting strategy may be to devise a cruise route that doesn't cross any such zones or perhaps works entirely WITHIN one. Your average speed through a zone could be very low - especially if you turn round inside it and then drive a little bit faster....

Couple of things:

1. Who is paying for all this? You and me. The government doesn't have a problem with chucking insane amounts of money at banks with no hope of getting it back, what's the betting that this little bit of larceny falls under the "infrastructure projects" banner -- rather than fixing the roads with our money, they're going to use our own money to make our lives more miserable. I don't see "prohibitively expensive" being an issue.

2. The cameras sound very clever, they are not point to point. I fear that building complex routes between two cameras will be VERY difficult.

Titan · Post by **Titan** » Sun 08 Mar, 2009 18:08

spokey wrote:Who is paying for all this? You and me

If there's only you and me - Problem solved!
We just don't pay

Jonttt · Post by **Jonttt** » Sun 08 Mar, 2009 19:15

I think I know the company that has been working on this technology.

From what I gather will be rolled out across motorway network first. The system is working now and has been tested during last year

http://www.zroadster.net/forum/viewtopi ... highlight=

SCORPION · Post by **SCORPION** » Sun 08 Mar, 2009 19:33

Most single track lanes with grass growing down the middle are derestricted which means it is permissible to drive down (or up) them at 60mph but no sensible person would do so. Although in future these will be the aforementioned roads without the power supply for speed cameras.
The government should be spending our money on education and training. In fact Spokey could be the Minister for Sensible Driving at Speed. How many miles of safe cruising has Spokey organised ?

whiteminks · Post by **whiteminks** » Sun 08 Mar, 2009 19:45

Was going to call the government a very rude word but then remembered I was on ZR

As for accidents on rural roads............ banning tractors in rush hour might help prevent a few accidents as chances taken are usually when people are stuck behind one for miles at 30mph. Also bloody lorries crawling at 40mph.
I dread to think of the petrol I waste being stuck at 40mph when I could be going 56mph in a 60 miles an hour limit. Unfortunately some of the A roads near me are those with few overtaking place and lots of dips/bends in the road.

Gazza · Post by **Gazza** » Sun 08 Mar, 2009 22:38

Need to perfect one of these for the rear

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WOdSxcUi ... re=related

garyw · Post by **garyw** » Sun 08 Mar, 2009 23:44

whiteminks wrote:Also bloody lorries crawling at 40mph.
I dread to think of the petrol I waste being stuck at 40mph when I could be going 56mph in a 60 miles an hour limit. :

Sadly thats becuase that is their speed limit on those roads...

Built up areas - up to 30 miles per hour.
Single carriageway - up to 40 miles per hour.
Dual carriageway - up to 50 miles per hour.
Motorway - up to 60 miles per hour.

garyw

whiteminks · Post by **whiteminks** » Mon 09 Mar, 2009 09:43

garyw wrote:
whiteminks wrote:Also bloody lorries crawling at 40mph.
I dread to think of the petrol I waste being stuck at 40mph when I could be going 56mph in a 60 miles an hour limit. :
Sadly thats becuase that is their speed limit on those roads...

Built up areas - up to 30 miles per hour.
Single carriageway - up to 40 miles per hour.
Dual carriageway - up to 50 miles per hour.
Motorway - up to 60 miles per hour.

garyw

Yes Gary , I know

, but my point is that is having a slower speed limit doesn't always seem to make the roads any safer, it just p155es people off and then they take chances to get past. This then causes accidents.

c_w · Post by **c_w** » Mon 09 Mar, 2009 11:22

whiteminks wrote: I dread to think of the petrol I waste being stuck at 40mph when I could be going 56mph in a 60 miles an hour limit.

How can you use more petrol going faster?

I think 56mph is just an arbitrary figure to compare mpg figures?

Even more annoying is the 45mph brigade, people in cars who do that speed EVERYWHERE!!

whiteminks · Post by **whiteminks** » Mon 09 Mar, 2009 11:48

Mmmmmmmmmmm these people seem to think there is an optimal efficient speed for fuel economy, but after reading it it appears to vary depending on your vehicle?

http://ecomodder.com/forum/showthread.p ... -1357.html

Jezza Clarkson seemed to think it was 56mph when he was trying to get as many mpg as he could out of full tank from an Audi A8?

Zed_Steve · Post by **Zed_Steve** » Mon 09 Mar, 2009 13:06

The country is in the s**t financially, partly because of this useless government so they need bring in as much revenue as they can to try and rebalance the books.
Placing these cash machines, sorry speed cameras on almost every road is one way of doing this, as they know that the motorist is an easy target!

c_w · Post by **c_w** » Mon 09 Mar, 2009 13:41

whiteminks wrote:Mmmmmmmmmmm these people seem to think there is an optimal efficient speed for fuel economy, but after reading it it appears to vary depending on your vehicle?

http://ecomodder.com/forum/showthread.p ... -1357.html

Jezza Clarkson seemed to think it was 56mph when he was trying to get as many mpg as he could out of full tank from an Audi A8?

I think you're right, it probably varies on the car (aerodynanic efficicen, engine power and gearing are probably the big factors), I think what happens is that mpg drops off dramatrically after certain speeds so 56 may have been settled on as a speed that gets you somewhere at a half-decent speed but still with good mpg.

Alfie · Post by **Alfie** » Mon 09 Mar, 2009 13:45

If this does actually happen, then every single clean, safe driver in the UK will sooner or later get tickets and points, and a massive number will get the 12 point ban.

How can this be right?
If you've proven your safety record as a capable driver, why should you suddenly get persecuted because of a change in the law which is thinly veiled as 'road safety', but is so obviously nothing more than a massive cash cow?

If I can be a little immodest for the sake of making the point...I've driven all over the UK, all over Western Europe, and several times in the USA and Caribbean.
In nearly 30 years of driving, I have covered many hundreds of thousands of miles in many different vehicles. In all that time I have never (with the exception of one very minor nudge in 1985) had an accident. (He says whilst furiously touching wood

)
I have also never had a ticket for any driving offense. Yep, I know I've been lucky...or maybe that should read 'careful'?

I just know that this fearsome totalitarian national 'average' speed camera network will catch me out and prosecute me for driving safely. After 30 years of blemish-free motoring, I'll end up lots more quid out of pocket and in the dock.

Once again this gov't of 'dumb-down Britain' wins out. Make it understandable for the most stupid and then everybody else has to live by it.

And how many more accidents will we see due to drivers losing concentration at monotonous slow speeds?

Anybody who supports these measures is either a non-driver (and therefore whose opinion should be ignored) or a very inexperienced driver who has not yet learned the practical rules of the road.

Training and experience, NOT prosecution, is the only genuine way forward in road safety.

I desperately hope we get a general election before this becomes law.

A.

smartypants · Post by **smartypants** » Mon 09 Mar, 2009 14:17

Only one word for our government, and it begins with a "C" and its not very nice

50mph = more congestion = more frustration = me killing someone eventually, probably with a blunt knife or a rusty spoon

smartypants · Post by **smartypants** » Mon 09 Mar, 2009 14:23

Alfie wrote:If this does actually happen, then every single clean, safe driver in the UK will sooner or later get tickets and points, and a massive number will get the 12 point ban.

How can this be right?
If you've proven your safety record as a capable driver, why should you suddenly get persecuted because of a change in the law which is thinly veiled as 'road safety', but is so obviously nothing more than a massive cash cow?

If I can be a little immodest for the sake of making the point...I've driven all over the UK, all over Western Europe, and several times in the USA and Caribbean.
In nearly 30 years of driving, I have covered many hundreds of thousands of miles in many different vehicles. In all that time I have never (with the exception of one very minor nudge in 1985) had an accident. (He says whilst furiously touching wood )
I have also never had a ticket for any driving offense. Yep, I know I've been lucky...or maybe that should read 'careful'?

I just know that this fearsome totalitarian national 'average' speed camera network will catch me out and prosecute me for driving safely. After 30 years of blemish-free motoring, I'll end up lots more quid out of pocket and in the dock.

Once again this gov't of 'dumb-down Britain' wins out. Make it understandable for the most stupid and then everybody else has to live by it.

And how many more accidents will we see due to drivers losing concentration at monotonous slow speeds?

Anybody who supports these measures is either a non-driver (and therefore whose opinion should be ignored) or a very inexperienced driver who has not yet learned the practical rules of the road.

Training and experience, NOT prosecution, is the only genuine way forward in road safety.

I desperately hope we get a general election before this becomes law.

A.

100% agree with you Alfie and sums my feelings up to a tea. 13 years of driving and 18k+ miles a year in varying cars in varying conditions, only in December was I caught out by a sneaky speed cam disguised as a traffic signal cam (not even sign posted) on a dual carriage way junction into a 30 limit.. but other than that no accidents, no tickets.

I feel now I cannot take my eyes off my speedo even in areas that i know because they may have stationed a camera overnight. I dont over take someone doing 50 in a 60 at 51mph, i accelerate past them until I am clear. I will probably reach 75, before slowing down to 60. But for that maneouvre alone, I'd get 3 points.

This WILL happen... I am sure of it though.

domross · Post by **domross** » Mon 09 Mar, 2009 14:39

suspect what the b**tards will do is introduce the speed cameras and not change the speed limit...cue lots of motorists breathing sigh of relief....whilst simultaneously forgetting the fact our civil liberties and to an extent our freedom are further being shafted...cynical??? me???

BTW smartypants....if no sign...no fine...it is illegal for them to speed-cam you without notice...think there has to be a sign within a certain distance of speed-cam...sure some-one will correct me if I'm wrong....

smartypants · Post by **smartypants** » Mon 09 Mar, 2009 14:58

Well there was a sign that said "Traffic signal camera". In my eyes thats worse, as it indicates that the camera is there specifically for red light jumping and NOT for speeding.

Reading an online times article in the other thread, a good comment made was:

"so let me get this straight: the official research shows that in years where speed limit enforcement by gatsos, speed cameras etc. has been rampant, road safety has actually decreased and the answer is "more of the same"? And they say this with a straight face??"

spokey · Post by **spokey** » Mon 09 Mar, 2009 17:16

Well, I hope everyone will sign up to this.

whiteminks · Post by **whiteminks** » Mon 09 Mar, 2009 17:26

Done................ the money grabbing barstewards

Zed Carer · Post by **Zed Carer** » Mon 09 Mar, 2009 17:33

Signed up

smartypants · Post by **smartypants** » Mon 09 Mar, 2009 18:54

Titan · Post by **Titan** » Mon 09 Mar, 2009 18:56

Me too

tomparri · Post by **tomparri** » Mon 09 Mar, 2009 20:07

Hi Spokey
Thanks for the link - one more point for everybody - when you've signed up please forward the petition website link to all your address book so everyone interested (i.e. all drivers) can sign up.
Tom

mc.d · Post by **mc.d** » Mon 09 Mar, 2009 20:17

Have signed and forwarded to fellow motorists/family

calbens · Post by **calbens** » Mon 09 Mar, 2009 20:42

Signed and forwarded

Gazza · Post by **Gazza** » Mon 09 Mar, 2009 20:42

Signed

smartypants · Post by **smartypants** » Mon 09 Mar, 2009 21:55

Yep forwarded on through a few forums and email contacts

Z3M Jason · Post by **Z3M Jason** » Mon 09 Mar, 2009 22:26

Utter madness!!! Still I moved to South of France so all you lot welcome for some mountain road and tunnel action

Bloody great!

Gazza · Post by **Gazza** » Mon 09 Mar, 2009 23:13

Hmmmm, a cruise and a cruise

unclemart · Post by **unclemart** » Tue 10 Mar, 2009 00:26

Signed -

So who voted Gordon in ?

Ahhh... I remember now nobody thats it !!!

Ian_C · Post by **Ian_C** » Tue 10 Mar, 2009 09:53

Signed

TrickyZ1 · Post by **TrickyZ1** » Tue 10 Mar, 2009 10:05

spokey wrote:Well, I hope everyone will sign up to this.

Thanks for that, signed and forwarded

Zed_Steve · Post by **Zed_Steve** » Tue 10 Mar, 2009 13:35

There was a chap being interviewed on breakfast news this morning, a road safety campaigner. He is in favour of the proposed speed reductions.
His daugher was mown down and killed by a speeding driver. Apparently the driver was pumped up on cocaine and was going wayyy over 70mph when the accident happened. Sorry, but how is reducing the speed limit from 60mph to 50mph going to address that particular case??
Deal with the drug drivers, deal with excessive speedsters, and dangerous drivers. But dont tarnish everyone with the same brush!!

smartypants · Post by **smartypants** » Tue 10 Mar, 2009 15:39

Zed_Steve wrote:There was a chap being interviewed on breakfast news this morning, a road safety campaigner. He is in favour of the proposed speed reductions.
His daugher was mown down and killed by a speeding driver. Apparently the driver was pumped up on cocaine and was going wayyy over 70mph when the accident happened. Sorry, but how is reducing the speed limit from 60mph to 50mph going to address that particular case??
Deal with the drug drivers, deal with excessive speedsters, and dangerous drivers. But dont tarnish everyone with the same brush!!

Quite.

SpunkyM · Post by **SpunkyM** » Tue 10 Mar, 2009 16:47

Back to the Isle of Mann it is then! Enjoy the country roads as god intended... limit free.

zroadster.net

The death of the cruise?

The death of the cruise?

Re: The death of the cruise?

Re: The death of the cruise?

Big Brother

Re: The death of the cruise?

Re: The death of the cruise?

Reduction in NSL