Gearbox and differential oil replacement.
Gearbox and differential oil replacement.
I have previously been advised by BMW dealer that the gearbox and diffs are sealed for life and the oil does not need to be changed.
Not sure what BMW define as "life" but I suspect an oil change after 20 years will do no harm.
After investigation the Z1 has a Getrag 260/5 gearbox from the E30 325i. capacity is 1.25 litres but is it oil or ATF ? Seems the gearbox has a colour coded label next to the drain plug, red label is D4 ATF, green label 75w90 oil.
Anyone changed the oils and knows which fluid is required? otherwise I will need to remove the under tray and have a peep.
Diff oil ... 125w140 or 75w90 ??
TJS
Not sure what BMW define as "life" but I suspect an oil change after 20 years will do no harm.
After investigation the Z1 has a Getrag 260/5 gearbox from the E30 325i. capacity is 1.25 litres but is it oil or ATF ? Seems the gearbox has a colour coded label next to the drain plug, red label is D4 ATF, green label 75w90 oil.
Anyone changed the oils and knows which fluid is required? otherwise I will need to remove the under tray and have a peep.
Diff oil ... 125w140 or 75w90 ??
TJS
Tony,
I think the (ridiculous) 'sealed for life' claim is only on the newer cars. The E30 and contemporaries do have a change schedule, I just can't read the German in my service book!
I would recommend 24,000 miles for Gearbox oil changes and 48,000 for the Differential - I seem to recall that is what the 325i was but I am sure someone will correct me if I am way out.
BMW are very specific about the Gearbox being Mobil SHC 630, which is very light (I think it is ATF) and any decent hypoid gear oil for the Diff.
I hope this helps - any news on those doors yet? Nag nag.....
I think the (ridiculous) 'sealed for life' claim is only on the newer cars. The E30 and contemporaries do have a change schedule, I just can't read the German in my service book!
I would recommend 24,000 miles for Gearbox oil changes and 48,000 for the Differential - I seem to recall that is what the 325i was but I am sure someone will correct me if I am way out.
BMW are very specific about the Gearbox being Mobil SHC 630, which is very light (I think it is ATF) and any decent hypoid gear oil for the Diff.
I hope this helps - any news on those doors yet? Nag nag.....
Best regards,
Sam Lever.
Anyone who says money isn't everything hasn't found the right classic car yet.
Z1 - 3.0csl - 987 Boxster - Rolls 20 - '72 911T - 997 GTS
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Sam Lever.
Anyone who says money isn't everything hasn't found the right classic car yet.
Z1 - 3.0csl - 987 Boxster - Rolls 20 - '72 911T - 997 GTS
Black Sport Evo M3 & SG M3 CSL & Austin 7 Special - now someone else's pleasure
Blue 2800cs - now someone else's pain
Old cars - the original "Not for Profit" organisation
Independent Financial Adviser in Buckingham
My Financial Blog
Hi Tony, hi Sam,
I have just had a look to the Technical Information System (TIS)
The oil of the shifting gearbox and the rear axle gearbox should be replaced every 48.000 km.
Following is written down there:
Orange sticker with the text "ATF-Oil!" near to the filler plug should be filled with ATF-Oil (If you need, I can send you a list of the allowed oils as PDF by email.
Green sticker with the text "Special Oil!!" near to the filler plug should be filled with BMW gearbox oil Parts-No. 81 22 9 407 305 (20 liter)
By using in cold conditions you can also use HD-engine oil SAE40, SAE30 or SAE20 to reduce the needed power for shifting the gears (Maybe the gearbox will make more mechanical noises then)
Gearboxes without sticker could be filled with SAE80 according to specification MIL-L-2105 or API-GL-4
By using in cold conditions you can also use HD-engine oil SAE40, SAE30 or SAE20 to reduce the needed power for shifting the gears (Maybe the gearbox will make more mechanical noises then)
When you are living in an area with extreme low temperatures (at the noth pole for example *lol*) you also can use ATF-Oil
Rear Axle without differential lock or with visco lock (from iX-modells):
Products name - Maker/deliverer
-------------------------------------------
AGIP HLX - Agip
Aral Getriebeöl BS - Aral
Castrol SAF-X0 - Castrol
Dearon BHS - Dea
FINA PONTONIC MS - Fina
FINA PONTONIC MX - Fina
Veedol SAF 66 - Veedol
Mobil Gearlube VS 600 - Mobil
BP Energear SHX - BP
VALVOLINE HL Plus - Valvoline
TRANSELF BM 75W-90 - Elf
Shell Getriebeöl OLS-BMW - Shell
Westfalen Fugo - BMO Westfalen AG
MOTUL HYPO SYNT - Motul
Avia Hypoid 75W-90 EP - Avia
Esso Getriebeöl NLS 75W-90 - Esso
Fuchs TITAN Gear H 75W-90 - Fuchs
Wintershall Getriebefluid - BOS Schmierstoffraffinerie Salzbergen GmbH
Rear axle with mechanical differential lock:
Products name - Maker/deliverer
---------------------------------------
Castrol SAF-XJ - Castrol
Veedol SAF 44 - Veedol
Mobil Getriebeöl VS 500 - Mobil
Aral Getriebeöl BS-LSX - Aral
BP Energear SHX-ZR - BP
Avia Hypoid 75W-140 LSX - Avia
Agip HLZ - Agip
FINA PONTONIC MLX - Fina
Shell Getriebeöl ZLS-BMW - Shell
Wintershall Getriebefluid BMS Plus - Schmierstoffraffinerie Salzbergen GmbH
Westfalen Fugo - BMS Westfalen AG
Hope that will help you...
Best regards
Michael
http://www.leder-pflege.de/
http://www.roadster-fashion.de
http://leder-pflege.zett-eins.de/catalog/
I have just had a look to the Technical Information System (TIS)
The oil of the shifting gearbox and the rear axle gearbox should be replaced every 48.000 km.
Following is written down there:
Orange sticker with the text "ATF-Oil!" near to the filler plug should be filled with ATF-Oil (If you need, I can send you a list of the allowed oils as PDF by email.
Green sticker with the text "Special Oil!!" near to the filler plug should be filled with BMW gearbox oil Parts-No. 81 22 9 407 305 (20 liter)
By using in cold conditions you can also use HD-engine oil SAE40, SAE30 or SAE20 to reduce the needed power for shifting the gears (Maybe the gearbox will make more mechanical noises then)
Gearboxes without sticker could be filled with SAE80 according to specification MIL-L-2105 or API-GL-4
By using in cold conditions you can also use HD-engine oil SAE40, SAE30 or SAE20 to reduce the needed power for shifting the gears (Maybe the gearbox will make more mechanical noises then)
When you are living in an area with extreme low temperatures (at the noth pole for example *lol*) you also can use ATF-Oil
Rear Axle without differential lock or with visco lock (from iX-modells):
Products name - Maker/deliverer
-------------------------------------------
AGIP HLX - Agip
Aral Getriebeöl BS - Aral
Castrol SAF-X0 - Castrol
Dearon BHS - Dea
FINA PONTONIC MS - Fina
FINA PONTONIC MX - Fina
Veedol SAF 66 - Veedol
Mobil Gearlube VS 600 - Mobil
BP Energear SHX - BP
VALVOLINE HL Plus - Valvoline
TRANSELF BM 75W-90 - Elf
Shell Getriebeöl OLS-BMW - Shell
Westfalen Fugo - BMO Westfalen AG
MOTUL HYPO SYNT - Motul
Avia Hypoid 75W-90 EP - Avia
Esso Getriebeöl NLS 75W-90 - Esso
Fuchs TITAN Gear H 75W-90 - Fuchs
Wintershall Getriebefluid - BOS Schmierstoffraffinerie Salzbergen GmbH
Rear axle with mechanical differential lock:
Products name - Maker/deliverer
---------------------------------------
Castrol SAF-XJ - Castrol
Veedol SAF 44 - Veedol
Mobil Getriebeöl VS 500 - Mobil
Aral Getriebeöl BS-LSX - Aral
BP Energear SHX-ZR - BP
Avia Hypoid 75W-140 LSX - Avia
Agip HLZ - Agip
FINA PONTONIC MLX - Fina
Shell Getriebeöl ZLS-BMW - Shell
Wintershall Getriebefluid BMS Plus - Schmierstoffraffinerie Salzbergen GmbH
Westfalen Fugo - BMS Westfalen AG
Hope that will help you...
Best regards
Michael
http://www.leder-pflege.de/
http://www.roadster-fashion.de
http://leder-pflege.zett-eins.de/catalog/
Last edited by Stoertie on Fri 27 Nov, 2009 08:50, edited 1 time in total.
Men of steel driving cars of plastic!
Sorry, for my poor english... schooltime is already a few years ago, but I try to do my very best!
If you like, please visit Z1-Nordlichter / Leather Care / Roadster-Fashion.de
I believe I can fly... *lalala*
Sorry, for my poor english... schooltime is already a few years ago, but I try to do my very best!
If you like, please visit Z1-Nordlichter / Leather Care / Roadster-Fashion.de
I believe I can fly... *lalala*
- Green Genie
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- Joined: Thu 01 May, 2008 17:29
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Looks like Michael has got this well covered.
For what it's worth when my car had a major service at Munich Legends these are the oils that they put in the car.
Engine: Castrol GTX Magnatec
Diff: Castrol SAF XO
Gearbox: Castrol SMX
Power Steering: Castrol TQ Dextron III
My car would appear to be running OK...
GG
For what it's worth when my car had a major service at Munich Legends these are the oils that they put in the car.
Engine: Castrol GTX Magnatec
Diff: Castrol SAF XO
Gearbox: Castrol SMX
Power Steering: Castrol TQ Dextron III
My car would appear to be running OK...
GG
Ohhh no you will never disagreeing with me in this point. I just collected the informations out of the TIS... So you don't disagree with me(!)...
For my engine I use "Motul V300 Competition" the gearbox we filled with ATF (but I don't remember which one) and my slip diff (25% locked) I filled up with Castrol SAF-XJ. For the power steering we used also a recommanded BMW oil and everything is fine.
Have a nice day...
Michael
Men of steel driving cars of plastic!
Sorry, for my poor english... schooltime is already a few years ago, but I try to do my very best!
If you like, please visit Z1-Nordlichter / Leather Care / Roadster-Fashion.de
I believe I can fly... *lalala*
Sorry, for my poor english... schooltime is already a few years ago, but I try to do my very best!
If you like, please visit Z1-Nordlichter / Leather Care / Roadster-Fashion.de
I believe I can fly... *lalala*
Does anyone believe there to be a time problem with gearbox and diff oils?
When a large BMW dealer last serviced my car I specifically asked for the gearbox oil to be changed. It was only when I got home and looked at the bill that I discovered that there was no charge for the gearbox oil. I called them and they said they hadn't done it because they didn't have the oil and they could only buy it in 200litre cans!
Really helpful!
So I still have the job outstanding. Should I bother that the oil is 6 years old? It has only done 12,000 miles.
Any thoughts?
Pat
When a large BMW dealer last serviced my car I specifically asked for the gearbox oil to be changed. It was only when I got home and looked at the bill that I discovered that there was no charge for the gearbox oil. I called them and they said they hadn't done it because they didn't have the oil and they could only buy it in 200litre cans!
Really helpful!
So I still have the job outstanding. Should I bother that the oil is 6 years old? It has only done 12,000 miles.
Any thoughts?
Pat
Pat,
Gearbox oil takes a lot less punishment than engine oil, as there is (hopefully) no combustion process to worry about. The only fear I suppose is that the succession of warm-up followed by cool-down phases means that condensation occurs and themoisture content builds up leading to a degradation of the oil.
Also, if there ever is a problem such as a chipped cog or suchlike, an oil change is likely to get rid of the foreign bodies (iron filings usually) that can lead to accelerated wear.
I would change it when you can. I am sure that Frederic (from France) had some Mobil SHC that he was offering for sale, it might be worth PM-ing him?
Failing that, Michael's list of comparable oils must help. Try Opie Oils for an equivalent. I buy my oils from them and they are very helpful.
Good luck.
Gearbox oil takes a lot less punishment than engine oil, as there is (hopefully) no combustion process to worry about. The only fear I suppose is that the succession of warm-up followed by cool-down phases means that condensation occurs and themoisture content builds up leading to a degradation of the oil.
Also, if there ever is a problem such as a chipped cog or suchlike, an oil change is likely to get rid of the foreign bodies (iron filings usually) that can lead to accelerated wear.
I would change it when you can. I am sure that Frederic (from France) had some Mobil SHC that he was offering for sale, it might be worth PM-ing him?
Failing that, Michael's list of comparable oils must help. Try Opie Oils for an equivalent. I buy my oils from them and they are very helpful.
Good luck.
Best regards,
Sam Lever.
Anyone who says money isn't everything hasn't found the right classic car yet.
Z1 - 3.0csl - 987 Boxster - Rolls 20 - '72 911T - 997 GTS
Black Sport Evo M3 & SG M3 CSL & Austin 7 Special - now someone else's pleasure
Blue 2800cs - now someone else's pain
Old cars - the original "Not for Profit" organisation
Independent Financial Adviser in Buckingham
My Financial Blog
Sam Lever.
Anyone who says money isn't everything hasn't found the right classic car yet.
Z1 - 3.0csl - 987 Boxster - Rolls 20 - '72 911T - 997 GTS
Black Sport Evo M3 & SG M3 CSL & Austin 7 Special - now someone else's pleasure
Blue 2800cs - now someone else's pain
Old cars - the original "Not for Profit" organisation
Independent Financial Adviser in Buckingham
My Financial Blog
Thanks for the responses which are useful.
So ... all Z1's have the 3 different options for the gearbox oil depending on label or no label plus colour of the label if it has one.
Next weekend is allocated for the Z1, adjust the door mechanism, under trays off to change the gearbox / diff oil while its on a ramp. Panels back on and MoT test the following week. Having recently topped up the gearbox / overdrive oil in the MGB GT by feel with a series of tubes and funnel I have invested £12 in a small mini pump so the Z1 job should be easy if the filler and drain plugs undo.
Fingers crossed, I may make the Dutch Invasion Tour.
I did ask for all the fluids on the car to be changed at the Inspection 2 service last year prior to the French trip but, on checking the invoice, the dealer later claimed the gearbox and diff were sealed for life items plus they did not have time to flush out the cooling system and replace the antifreeze. I suspect they didn't realise the Z1 had under trays which needed to be removed so they couldn't be bothered. However, I did get a £100 refund off the bill as their quote did include these items.
TJS
So ... all Z1's have the 3 different options for the gearbox oil depending on label or no label plus colour of the label if it has one.
Next weekend is allocated for the Z1, adjust the door mechanism, under trays off to change the gearbox / diff oil while its on a ramp. Panels back on and MoT test the following week. Having recently topped up the gearbox / overdrive oil in the MGB GT by feel with a series of tubes and funnel I have invested £12 in a small mini pump so the Z1 job should be easy if the filler and drain plugs undo.
Fingers crossed, I may make the Dutch Invasion Tour.
I did ask for all the fluids on the car to be changed at the Inspection 2 service last year prior to the French trip but, on checking the invoice, the dealer later claimed the gearbox and diff were sealed for life items plus they did not have time to flush out the cooling system and replace the antifreeze. I suspect they didn't realise the Z1 had under trays which needed to be removed so they couldn't be bothered. However, I did get a £100 refund off the bill as their quote did include these items.
TJS
-
- Joined: Mon 17 Nov, 2003 16:43
- Posts: 223
- Contact:
Hi,
I have a fresh drum of SHC 630 for sale if you need
http://www.zroadster.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=17289
This oil is so difficult to find that we bought a 20L drum and shared it with few friends. I still have some remaining if you need.
Regarding diff oil, I can also have the right oil by CASTROL recommended by BMW, it's not expensive, ie 10/12 EUR for 1 L bottle (you need 2) ; but you must be able to find it in UK
Frederic
I have a fresh drum of SHC 630 for sale if you need
http://www.zroadster.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=17289
This oil is so difficult to find that we bought a 20L drum and shared it with few friends. I still have some remaining if you need.
Regarding diff oil, I can also have the right oil by CASTROL recommended by BMW, it's not expensive, ie 10/12 EUR for 1 L bottle (you need 2) ; but you must be able to find it in UK
Frederic
Absolutely agree...I use Redline in all my manual transmissions as well. It is a synthetic which makes a huge difference over conventional oils (just like synthetics are more slippery in your engine, too).felix wrote:I swear by Redline MTL in BMW manual gearboxes.
"Asphalt is evil, it must be punished!"
1989 Z1, 1990 Z1, 1998 318ti (supercharged--The Original Budget M3), 2003 M3 Cabrio, 1985 M635Csi, 2006 Cayenne Turbo, 1960 Airstream Land Yacht
1989 Z1, 1990 Z1, 1998 318ti (supercharged--The Original Budget M3), 2003 M3 Cabrio, 1985 M635Csi, 2006 Cayenne Turbo, 1960 Airstream Land Yacht
Just noticed Sam has already covered the Opie Oils, I really should read before I post.sfh3l wrote:Pat,
Gearbox oil takes a lot less punishment than engine oil, as there is (hopefully) no combustion process to worry about. The only fear I suppose is that the succession of warm-up followed by cool-down phases means that condensation occurs and themoisture content builds up leading to a degradation of the oil.
Also, if there ever is a problem such as a chipped cog or suchlike, an oil change is likely to get rid of the foreign bodies (iron filings usually) that can lead to accelerated wear.
I would change it when you can. I am sure that Frederic (from France) had some Mobil SHC that he was offering for sale, it might be worth PM-ing him?
Failing that, Michael's list of comparable oils must help. Try Opie Oils for an equivalent. I buy my oils from them and they are very helpful.
Good luck.
Pat, if you come to a conclusion with the Gearbox oil, would you mind letting me know, I want to replace all my fluids before the tour. Just finished flushing out all the brake/clutch fluids, now I want to focus on the Power Steering, Diff and Gearbox oils.
- PhoenixCoupe
- Joined: Wed 02 May, 2007 00:46
- Posts: 739
- Location: Mars
I had a 740i with a 'sealed for life' auto gearbox and found that changing the oil and filters after a few years made a world of difference to the shifting - it was much smoother, not that it was bad to start with, but, there was a definite change in it.
The 'sealed for life' boxes still have a filler hidden away, so, obviously someone disagrees with the theory!
The 'sealed for life' boxes still have a filler hidden away, so, obviously someone disagrees with the theory!
押忍!闘え!応援団
Latest situation re gearbox oil ... watch this space.
Mr Smith,
Interesting one this, for some reason the Z1 does use a different oil, the Mobil SHC630 is only available in 20ltr drums, as is the other matches I have found as it is generally a commercial gear oil. It is quite a high grade synthetic. I am not sure what alternatives there are at the moment, but I am looking and will be intouch when I find something.
Regards
Guy
For recommendations http://www.opieoils.co.uk/
For telephone sales call Guy on 01209 215164
________________________________
From: SUSAN SMITH
Sent: Mon 04/05/2009 21:11
To: Opie Oils
Subject: BMW Z1 gearbox oil. ??
Hi
! need to replace the gearbox oil in a 1990 BMW Z1.
The gear box has a green sticker marked "special oil" BMW gearbox oil part no 81 22 9407 305.
I believe the BMW recommended oil is (was) Mobil SHC630. The local BMW dealer will provide oil to the above spec but I must by a minimum 20 litres. 2 litres is more than enough.
Do you supply Mobil SHC630 ?? What is the correct specification alternative
Regards
T J Smith
Mr Smith,
Interesting one this, for some reason the Z1 does use a different oil, the Mobil SHC630 is only available in 20ltr drums, as is the other matches I have found as it is generally a commercial gear oil. It is quite a high grade synthetic. I am not sure what alternatives there are at the moment, but I am looking and will be intouch when I find something.
Regards
Guy
For recommendations http://www.opieoils.co.uk/
For telephone sales call Guy on 01209 215164
________________________________
From: SUSAN SMITH
Sent: Mon 04/05/2009 21:11
To: Opie Oils
Subject: BMW Z1 gearbox oil. ??
Hi
! need to replace the gearbox oil in a 1990 BMW Z1.
The gear box has a green sticker marked "special oil" BMW gearbox oil part no 81 22 9407 305.
I believe the BMW recommended oil is (was) Mobil SHC630. The local BMW dealer will provide oil to the above spec but I must by a minimum 20 litres. 2 litres is more than enough.
Do you supply Mobil SHC630 ?? What is the correct specification alternative
Regards
T J Smith
I have had the same response from everyone I have spoken to, but I may have found a solution.TJS wrote:Latest situation re gearbox oil ... watch this space.
Mr Smith,
Interesting one this, for some reason the Z1 does use a different oil, the Mobil SHC630 is only available in 20ltr drums, as is the other matches I have found as it is generally a commercial gear oil. It is quite a high grade synthetic. I am not sure what alternatives there are at the moment, but I am looking and will be intouch when I find something.
Regards
Guy
For recommendations http://www.opieoils.co.uk/
For telephone sales call Guy on 01209 215164
________________________________
From: SUSAN SMITH
Sent: Mon 04/05/2009 21:11
To: Opie Oils
Subject: BMW Z1 gearbox oil. ??
Hi
! need to replace the gearbox oil in a 1990 BMW Z1.
The gear box has a green sticker marked "special oil" BMW gearbox oil part no 81 22 9407 305.
I believe the BMW recommended oil is (was) Mobil SHC630. The local BMW dealer will provide oil to the above spec but I must by a minimum 20 litres. 2 litres is more than enough.
Do you supply Mobil SHC630 ?? What is the correct specification alternative
Regards
T J Smith
Mobil SHC630 20ltr @ £6.97/ltr =£140 +vat+ £15 delivery, from some company in Wessex.
If anyone wants the 20ltr, I will buy 5ltrs from them or if there are 4 interested parties from the forum, we can split the cost.
Alternatively, just book the car into BMW and have them do it, that is likely to be costly, as they charge £330+vat for a 20ltr drum
Hi Lord Taki,Lord Taki wrote:Did you miss Frederic's post in this thread?
Maybe a member of the Z1 club has some oil left (I bought from him last year).
If you want I can ask him...
I didnt miss it, its just that the car was booked into the garage yesterday for all fluids to be replaced and I needed it in a hurry. I want to do this before the tour next week, so a UK supplier is preferred as I am running out of time and I can have it delivered the next day.
I did manage to flush out all the power steering fluid, its a lovely nice red colour once again.
regards
Jet
-
- Joined: Wed 22 Sep, 2004 15:48
- Posts: 140
- Location: Oxford
Me too
I'll take 5 litres too please Jet
Ok, TJS thanks for the update, so that rules you out?
Anyone else interested in replacing their oil? If your history does not show it as being replaced in the last 10years, it is a worthwhile and relatively economical investment, as this special oil cannot be purchased in small sizes and BMW charge at least £150 for a 30minute job. This is the recommended Oil by BMW for this car.
Any Takers?
Anyone else interested in replacing their oil? If your history does not show it as being replaced in the last 10years, it is a worthwhile and relatively economical investment, as this special oil cannot be purchased in small sizes and BMW charge at least £150 for a 30minute job. This is the recommended Oil by BMW for this car.
Any Takers?
Company: Wessex Petroleum
Telephone: 0238 0884013
Product: Mobil SHC630
Cost: £6.97/litre
Delivery: £15
Total: 20ltr = £140 +vat
BlueBaur will do the honours and get it ordered, I can do paypal payments, and Paul is leaving the country soon. I dont think we can use Royal mail to send Oil, but a courier company like Parcel2go are very cheap.
Give them a call and let us know, Terry is interested in having some, ideally we all only need 2 litres of the stuff.
Telephone: 0238 0884013
Product: Mobil SHC630
Cost: £6.97/litre
Delivery: £15
Total: 20ltr = £140 +vat
BlueBaur will do the honours and get it ordered, I can do paypal payments, and Paul is leaving the country soon. I dont think we can use Royal mail to send Oil, but a courier company like Parcel2go are very cheap.
Give them a call and let us know, Terry is interested in having some, ideally we all only need 2 litres of the stuff.
I use this courier, they sub to DHL
http://www.p4d.co.uk/
up to 20 Kilo for £10 depending on dimensions
http://www.p4d.co.uk/
up to 20 Kilo for £10 depending on dimensions
Open and close with German style and ingenuity!