Z3M wing mirrors - where can I get them? Buy or borrow?

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Choc
Joined: Sun 05 May, 2013 19:05
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  Z3 roadster 3.0i

Z3M wing mirrors - where can I get them? Buy or borrow?

Post by Choc »

I fancy using Z3M ring mirrors on my Bertini GT25 Z3 kits.
Hopefully with the aim of producing shells that can be used on standard Z3's

I have had a few problems finding where to buy them.
I have searched the forums and followed a few links to German eBay sellers. But no stock/response.

1. Does anyone have any for sale?
2. Can anyone 'rent' me a pair so I can investigate producing conversion shells?
3. Anybody know where I can find some online?
4. Does anyone know what BMW parts sell them for?

Thanks

Anthony
Bertini GT25 - Kitcar based on the BMW Z3 and Z3M roadster
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Robert T
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Re: Z3M wing mirrors - where can I get them? Buy or borrow?

Post by Robert T »

The mirror is shown here - click for parts list:

Image

Coopers currently want £221.87 for a complete mirror.

I'm not sure how a conversion kit will work - whilst the doors and thus the mounting position is the same between ///M and non-///M cars, the mirror base, casing and glass are all specific to the ///M version - pretty much only the motor is shared. It is a fairly common conversion to swap non-///M from ///M mirrors.

If you go down this route, then can you see about fixing the alloy core inside the mirror - this is prone to corrosion and goes brittle with age, meaning the it will snap when you try to retract the mirrors. If you can produce an affordable version of the ///M mirror which doesn't suffer from this problem, then they will sell like hot cakes!

Cheers R.
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deni2s
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Re: Z3M wing mirrors - where can I get them? Buy or borrow?

Post by deni2s »

You can also check bimmerforums z3 section - they often are here for sale, or ebay.
spurs fan in a coupe
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Re: Z3M wing mirrors - where can I get them? Buy or borrow?

Post by spurs fan in a coupe »

I have a pair of LHD ones for sale if that helps?
we expres: " He did hear the bells ringing, but doesnt know where where the clapper hangs".
Choc
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  Z3 roadster 3.0i

Re: Z3M wing mirrors - where can I get them? Buy or borrow?

Post by Choc »

What's the difference?
Is it just the lenses?
Can I just change them for RHD mirror lenses?

How much do you want for the pair?

Thanks
Bertini GT25 - Kitcar based on the BMW Z3 and Z3M roadster
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c_w
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Re: Z3M wing mirrors - where can I get them? Buy or borrow?

Post by c_w »

Curiously the RHD Z3Ms got a normal driver's mirror glass creating a huge blind spot as the field of view is too close, with the passenger one a convex mirror which is much more useful; I replaced my driver's mirror glass with a convex one off ebay. So in summary, I have no idea what makes LHD mirrors different (it is as though they never bothered swapping the glass for RHD cars).

From memory the mirror glass isn't handed, the ebay glass would fit either side.
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Robert T
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Re: Z3M wing mirrors - where can I get them? Buy or borrow?

Post by Robert T »

Assuming that the ///M mirrors are the same as the standard ones, the LHD and RHD versions are canted to different angles. This was discussed in a recent thread if you want to look for it.

Cheers R.

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Southernboy
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Re: Z3M wing mirrors - where can I get them? Buy or borrow?

Post by Southernboy »

LHD mirrors - both the M and the non M units - have a different base to swing arm angle. You can fit them, but the problem is that the adjustment angle of the mirror glass / motor is insufficient to provide the degree of flexibility for drivers of varying height, and consequently also the seat position in the forward / rear position, which in some instances makes a set of LHD mirrors on an RHD car useless, and the opposite is true of LHD cars fitted with RHD mirrors.
The use of convex mirrors helps somewhat, but still not sufficiently to be as flexible as intended on RHD CAR + RHD MIRROR / LHD + LHD. The issue is the base angle to the mirror swing arm - they are different on LHD and RHD units.
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spurs fan in a coupe
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Re: Z3M wing mirrors - where can I get them? Buy or borrow?

Post by spurs fan in a coupe »

Choc wrote:What's the difference?
Is it just the lenses?
Can I just change them for RHD mirror lenses?

How much do you want for the pair?

Thanks

http://www.zroadster.net/forum/viewtopi ... 11&t=39580

As stated above the angle of tilt/adjustment from the motor is insufficient on LHD for RHD vehicles, rendering them useless for seeing out of from the driver's seat.
we expres: " He did hear the bells ringing, but doesnt know where where the clapper hangs".
Pierrick
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  Z3 roadster 1.9

Re: Z3M wing mirrors - where can I get them? Buy or borrow?

Post by Pierrick »

Southernboy wrote:LHD mirrors - both the M and the non M units - have a different base to swing arm angle. You can fit them, but the problem is that the adjustment angle of the mirror glass / motor is insufficient to provide the degree of flexibility for drivers of varying height, and consequently also the seat position in the forward / rear position, which in some instances makes a set of LHD mirrors on an RHD car useless, and the opposite is true of LHD cars fitted with RHD mirrors.
The use of convex mirrors helps somewhat, but still not sufficiently to be as flexible as intended on RHD CAR + RHD MIRROR / LHD + LHD. The issue is the base angle to the mirror swing arm - they are different on LHD and RHD units.

I can confirm... I own a RHD Z3 and I bought some LHD mirrors last week from a breaker in France.
They looks exactly the same but there is a slight difference which you can only really see once they are fitted.
I still can see the car behind me on my right mirror (driver side) but even with the tilt adjusted to the maximum I have to move my head to see on the one on the left.

It's fine for the moment as I paid only 100€ and they are in ferfect condition (and the old one where falling appart... really!).

I'll change them as soon sa i'll find a cheap pair for a RHD car.


So Choc I would advise you to buy the right ones if you want to do a good job!
Dino D
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  Z3 roadster 2.8

Re: Z3M wing mirrors - where can I get them? Buy or borrow?

Post by Dino D »

Jut sent you a pm Choc about the genuine Rhd set I have.
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c_w
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Re: Z3M wing mirrors - where can I get them? Buy or borrow?

Post by c_w »

Did you consider the Mini Mirrors (or Rover 75 for that matter), both are very similar style oval mirrors which would be very cheap second hand and new parts probably not near the M Coupe's similar shaped mirror.
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Re: Z3M wing mirrors - where can I get them? Buy or borrow?

Post by cosmosblack »

i have been thinking about the mini wing mirrors, but how would you go about the wiring would you have to use the wires from the mini wing mirror or visa versa??
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Southernboy
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Re: Z3M wing mirrors - where can I get them? Buy or borrow?

Post by Southernboy »

The wiring is the same as for the bmw's...excluding the folding mirrors....there are a brown and black wire for the heated mirror element, and then there are the mirror motor wires...it is a matter of checking which wires on the mirror activate which action, ie. up /down & left / right...then checking them against the bmw wiring diagram for the oem switch...make sure you have them married correctly and away you go... I imagine bmw would likely as not used the same connectors in the mini as in their "own" bmw's...
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cosmosblack
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Re: Z3M wing mirrors - where can I get them? Buy or borrow?

Post by cosmosblack »

thats great i think i might have a go with the mini wing mirrors, i dont think its going to be easy, but i would love the M mirrors but they are so expensive the mini mirrors are cheap and if it dont look right i wont use them, fingers crossed it does go right thank you :)
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Brian H
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Re: Z3M wing mirrors - where can I get them? Buy or borrow?

Post by Brian H »

cosmosblack wrote:thats great i think i might have a go with the mini wing mirrors, i dont think its going to be easy, but i would love the M mirrors but they are so expensive the mini mirrors are cheap and if it dont look right i wont use them, fingers crossed it does go right thank you :)
I had a look at the mini wing mirrors a couple of years ago with a view to fitting them. I found the problem with the mini mirrors is that the spring mechanism protrudes out of the bottom of the base of the mirror and actually sits inside the door of the mini, (mini doors have a recess to accommodate this mechanism), the mirrors on a z3 are surface mount. I did not want to cut a big hole in my door and without redesigning the whole mirror base, for me it was a no go.
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Brian H
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Re: Z3M wing mirrors - where can I get them? Buy or borrow?

Post by Brian H »

Southernboy wrote:The wiring is the same as for the bmw's...excluding the folding mirrors....there are a brown and black wire for the heated mirror element, and then there are the mirror motor wires...it is a matter of checking which wires on the mirror activate which action, ie. up /down & left / right...then checking them against the bmw wiring diagram for the oem switch...make sure you have them married correctly and away you go... I imagine bmw would likely as not used the same connectors in the mini as in their "own" bmw's...
The wiring for the mirrors is just 4 wires on a standard Z, with the mirror switch in its central position the switch allows a +ve and -ve circuit for the heated mirrors to work, however have a look at the diagram for the switch and you will find the circuit is a little more tricky than standard switching.
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Re: Z3M wing mirrors - where can I get them? Buy or borrow?

Post by cosmosblack »

oh right i didnt know they had the spring well that would cause a problem, maybe i need to rethink, but more i look at them more i do like them, do you know roughly how much the spring comes out the base? do you think their is a way to maybe shorten the spring? cheers
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Brian H
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Re: Z3M wing mirrors - where can I get them? Buy or borrow?

Post by Brian H »

Cosmosblack,

The image below will give you some idea of the mirror and the recess in the mini door: -

Image

Image

I am not saying it cannot be retrofitted, just was not a project for me :wink:
cosmosblack
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Re: Z3M wing mirrors - where can I get them? Buy or borrow?

Post by cosmosblack »

wow that looks alot of work, you would have to cut the door on the z3, which i wouldn't have a clue on to begin, my car is being spayed in the coming months, that why i don't mind having a play, but this might be out of my league, shame really cos they are very cheap to buy
cosmosblack
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Re: Z3M wing mirrors - where can I get them? Buy or borrow?

Post by cosmosblack »

do you think their is enough depth to do a cut out like that in a z3 door?
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