Leak in rear which is weeting boot carpet, pooling in batter

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kjb1
Joined: Thu 04 Feb, 2016 11:12
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  Z3 roadster 1.9

Leak in rear which is weeting boot carpet, pooling in batter

Post by kjb1 »

Hi all

Have a 96 1.9, which has got a soggy rear end, wet carpets in boot area. Can anyone advise?

Rear window, fabric has pulled out in places from being tucked behind the lip, is there a more permanent fix for this rather than tucking down with a flat knife etc?

The rear third brake light, does this need to be re-gasketed?

Any issues with water entering via rear light clusters?

And are there any drains at the rear area I should be aware of?

Car been within my ownership for 24 hours, already changed air filter, replaced bonnet badge, machine polished my tarnished headlights, cleaned hood. Protected hood with waterproof tent spray. Good clean up inside involving tooth brush etc.

Just ordered new discs and pads for the front, need a new back box defo!!

Anyone have one they want to sell?

Many thanks.

Jon


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kkkrisss
Joined: Thu 13 Jan, 2011 09:15
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Re: Leak in rear which is weeting boot carpet, pooling in ba

Post by kkkrisss »

The water in the boot is usually due to the third brake light or the antenna grommet.
These are the first to check and cheapest to fix.
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Tufarlian
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Re: Leak in rear which is weeting boot carpet, pooling in ba

Post by Tufarlian »

For the rear window edging black silicon sealer makes a good adhesive (and sealer). A thin bead under the edge and then tuck it back in place.
This isn't going to be leaking into the boot though. If it leaks it will be into the car.

I've not had the problem with the third brake light but it is a known issue. Make sure you get the right gasket as I believe pre-facelift and facelift are different.

Mark
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kjb1
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  Z3 roadster 1.9

Re: Leak in rear which is weeting boot carpet, pooling in ba

Post by kjb1 »

Hahahaha just noticed what my wonderful iPhone has altered my title subject to!! :) it was meant to read "back"!!!!

Ok guys, really appreciate the tips so far, anyone recommend a sealant to purchase for the window fix.


my grommet is looking really nasty to be fair so this sounds like a good fix!!

The rear carpet within the root which runs up from the floor to the base of rear windscreen is wet, what would be the cause of this? is it where the roof meets the body work on the rear of the car?

can this be solved by packing out the seal that runs all the way around with some extra rubber packing behind it? as i have one point on the seal where when i pull the fabric back from the hood, i can see green where it looks like water been sitting.



Thanks again


i will put photos up later to explain, once this frost has buggered off!!!


although this car needs a lot of love ( bought as a project for me ) I can already see the appeal. i love my BMW's, although not currently in one for my main hack, went to the other side with my first Mercedes.

Cheers

Jon
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kjb1
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  Z3 roadster 1.9

Leak in rear which is weeting boot carpet, pooling in batter

Post by kjb1 »

any issues with rear lights leaking also?




and does anyone have an old back box laying around they want to sell?? or know of one?


Thanks
bertiejaffa
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Re: Leak in rear which is weeting boot carpet, pooling in ba

Post by bertiejaffa »

kjb1 wrote:Hahahaha just noticed what my wonderful iPhone has altered my title subject to!! :) it was meant to read "back"!!!!

Ok guys, really appreciate the tips so far, anyone recommend a sealant to purchase for the window fix.


my grommet is looking really nasty to be fair so this sounds like a good fix!!

The rear carpet within the root which runs up from the floor to the base of rear windscreen is wet, what would be the cause of this? is it where the roof meets the body work on the rear of the car?

can this be solved by packing out the seal that runs all the way around with some extra rubber packing behind it? as i have one point on the seal where when i pull the fabric back from the hood, i can see green where it looks like water been sitting.



Thanks again


i will put photos up later to explain, once this frost has buggered off!!!


although this car needs a lot of love ( bought as a project for me ) I can already see the appeal. i love my BMW's, although not currently in one for my main hack, went to the other side with my first Mercedes.

Cheers

Jon
definitely sounds like your seal (butyl) has rotten and you are getting water in between the roof and the car body. Look at Wookee's "Cinders" thread (still scrolling on the front page) he had the same issues
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bertiejaffa
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Re: Leak in rear which is weeting boot carpet, pooling in ba

Post by bertiejaffa »

I noticed you asking Wookee where the bolts are - check out this thread:

viewtopic.php?f=5&t=40753&p=381857&hili ... ey#p381857
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kjb1
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Re: Leak in rear which is weeting boot carpet, pooling in ba

Post by kjb1 »

bertiejaffa wrote:I noticed you asking Wookee where the bolts are - check out this thread:

viewtopic.php?f=5&t=40753&p=381857&hili ... ey#p381857
interesting thread! will be purchasing few bits mentioned and having a go!! can finally see where those bolts are. The carpets will be coming out of mine in the morning and will be attacking this come the dry weather.

Good stuff guys


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bentley-boy
Joined: Mon 28 Oct, 2013 19:35
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Re: Leak in rear which is weeting boot carpet, pooling in ba

Post by bentley-boy »

Hi, ref the aerial grommet, don't be tempted to buy one off ebay as they're half the price from the main dealers!!

BB
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kjb1
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Re: Leak in rear which is weeting boot carpet, pooling in ba

Post by kjb1 »

I nearly ordered the bay one!!! glad I didn't now.
Wookee
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Re: Leak in rear which is weeting boot carpet, pooling in ba

Post by Wookee »

kjb1 wrote:
bertiejaffa wrote:I noticed you asking Wookee where the bolts are - check out this thread:

viewtopic.php?f=5&t=40753&p=381857&hili ... ey#p381857
interesting thread! will be purchasing few bits mentioned and having a go!! can finally see where those bolts are. The carpets will be coming out of mine in the morning and will be attacking this come the dry weather.
With my aerial grommet it was easy to tell they (there are two - one above and one below the bodywork) as my tilt sensor was in 2 inches of water. I can't see how much of the water from this leak could get anywhere else in the boot other than that area. :shrug So if yours is dry then the new grommet won't solve your problem.

I have a facelift model so the brakelight gasket wasn't an issue and all I did with the seal between the hood and body was push it in properly- it sort of 'clicks' when it's in place. I didn't have to touch the bolts (other than the one that wasn't in) nor did I have to use any butyl tape to reinforce the seal.

From reading above it seems your leak(s) are confined to the boot? Is your parcel shelf dry? Any water on the seats at all?
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kjb1
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Re: Leak in rear which is weeting boot carpet, pooling in ba

Post by kjb1 »

Wookee wrote:
kjb1 wrote:
bertiejaffa wrote:I noticed you asking Wookee where the bolts are - check out this thread:

viewtopic.php?f=5&t=40753&p=381857&hili ... ey#p381857
interesting thread! will be purchasing few bits mentioned and having a go!! can finally see where those bolts are. The carpets will be coming out of mine in the morning and will be attacking this come the dry weather.
With my aerial grommet it was easy to tell they (there are two - one above and one below the bodywork) as my tilt sensor was in 2 inches of water. I can't see how much of the water from this leak could get anywhere else in the boot other than that area. :shrug So if yours is dry then the new grommet won't solve your problem.

I have a facelift model so the brakelight gasket wasn't an issue and all I did with the seal between the hood and body was push it in properly- it sort of 'clicks' when it's in place. I didn't have to touch the bolts (other than the one that wasn't in) nor did I have to use any butyl tape to reinforce the seal.

From reading above it seems your leak(s) are confined to the boot? Is your parcel shelf dry? Any water on the seats at all?
My rear parcel shelf is wet and noted that I saw water dripping from the window zip yesterday, so thats one source of my leak.

Im going to strip out the carpet from the shelf and look exactly where its coming in! which side did you push from for it to click? outside or inside?


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bertiejaffa
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Re: Leak in rear which is weeting boot carpet, pooling in ba

Post by bertiejaffa »

Thread for replacing the grommet http://www.zroadster.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=8613

As mentioned, the grommet will only lead to water in the tilt sensor to be honest. But even if its not leaking, if it is buggered then replace it - it cost nowt and takes 5 minutes (30 if you get your fat fingers wedged in the hole re my 2.0 thread).

Re the rest of the leaks, it defo sounds like your buytl seal is gone which needs the bolts un doing and the roof coming off and the buytl replaced - buy some off ebay. easy job just take a while to get the old buytl off. Also see the comments in Wookees thread regarding the water you will no doubt have to get out from below the carpets - it will be buckets full by the sounds of it

dont worry - all sounds bad but too be honest its all easy, just takes time
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kjb1
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Re: Leak in rear which is weeting boot carpet, pooling in ba

Post by kjb1 »

bertiejaffa wrote:Thread for replacing the grommet http://www.zroadster.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=8613

As mentioned, the grommet will only lead to water in the tilt sensor to be honest. But even if its not leaking, if it is buggered then replace it - it cost nowt and takes 5 minutes (30 if you get your fat fingers wedged in the hole re my 2.0 thread).

Re the rest of the leaks, it defo sounds like your buytl seal is gone which needs the bolts un doing and the roof coming off and the buytl replaced - buy some off ebay. easy job just take a while to get the old buytl off. Also see the comments in Wookees thread regarding the water you will no doubt have to get out from below the carpets - it will be buckets full by the sounds of it

dont worry - all sounds bad but too be honest its all easy, just takes time
When i remove the bolts holding roof to rear, will i simply be able to lift it out of the way folding it forward on itself to access this seal? and I've ordered that butyl tape, so I can redo sealant etc, does the seal sit either side over a run of that tape?

if that makes sense? will i run a strip of it either side of the body work? as in one on outer and one on inner, then replace the seal over the top of it, so it sits on the butyl itself? or am I completely wrong?

appreciated for all help so far.

My carpets under seats feel dry?


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bertiejaffa
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Re: Leak in rear which is weeting boot carpet, pooling in ba

Post by bertiejaffa »

After removing the bolts I lifted the entire roof out of the way. The tape sits between the car body and the lower edge of the roof - imagine it as a strip of double sided sticky tape - it'll be obvious when you see it. :wink:
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kjb1
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  Z3 roadster 1.9

Leak in rear which is weeting boot carpet, pooling in batter

Post by kjb1 »

Ok, so today, got a spell of good weather and decided to attempt a bit of further investigation. Few discoveries made:

1, Drain for fuel filler blocked - This was cleared by using a length of electrical cable and starting at the drain underneath the car and pushing it straight up till the point where it exited within the fuel filler area.

2, stripped rear parcel shelf of carpet to gain access to hood fixings which attach hood to the car. A few specs of water, but seemed that nothing was beyond the spill channel that captures any potential run off? see pics below

Noticed that one bolt has been covered in sealant? previous owner's attempt at a fix maybe. see below:

Image
Image
Image

3, Fitted a new " third brake light " gasket which arrived today, simple job, followed the great walk through found on this site, but fairly self explanatory.

4, Tightened up all the hood bolts, however I found one was turning and just not tightening up, what could be the issue here and will it be repairable when I remove the roof completely once my new sealant fix has arrived. See pic below for the bolt that just turns, its the one furthest away from the greasy trail coming under that seal:

Image

The only other thing I noticed, had a greasy trail running down from under that body seal, look at pic here:

Image
Image

Another question, the drain for the seal run off found in this picture ( drain both sides of hood ) where does it exit the car? any issues of these failing? blocking?

Image

5, Cleaned and protected the hood with Fabsil, second protection, so should be beading lovely now.

6, My main source of leaks are from the window, for which I am awaiting the black adhesive sealant to arrive to rectify.

Bought a smart battery charger from LIDL the other day ( £13 ) Its german and exactly same as the CTEK ones, its been on the Z3 for 2 days now and has brought the battery back to a lovely state of charge. :squeeze:
Wookee
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Re: Leak in rear which is weeting boot carpet, pooling in ba

Post by Wookee »

kjb1 wrote:
My rear parcel shelf is wet and noted that I saw water dripping from the window zip yesterday, so thats one source of my leak.

Im going to strip out the carpet from the shelf and look exactly where its coming in! which side did you push from for it to click? outside or inside?
From the looks of your pictures you haven't got much to worry about, the butyl tape will solve most of that. The seal I pushed back into place was the one around the outside.

With your window I too get this problem of moisture on the inside that tends to happen after a frosty night when the temperature starts rising again. I don't even bother worrying about it as the amount is so small compared to what I did have, and turning the heater on or wiping it with a cloth solves it.

With regards to your question about the drain from the seal getting blocked- I think that this is the drain either side of the car which would be by your right shoulder when you are sitting in the driver's seat. This is the main problem I had as one was blocked and the water was overflowing back onto the parcel shelf then into the boot. If you find them (It's a metal tray sort of thing with a hole in the side so you can get a socket in) and stick your finger in them they should both be dry. If there is any water standing in them then your drain is blocked.
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kjb1
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Re: Leak in rear which is weeting boot carpet, pooling in ba

Post by kjb1 »

Wookee wrote:
kjb1 wrote:
My rear parcel shelf is wet and noted that I saw water dripping from the window zip yesterday, so thats one source of my leak.

Im going to strip out the carpet from the shelf and look exactly where its coming in! which side did you push from for it to click? outside or inside?
From the looks of your pictures you haven't got much to worry about, the butyl tape will solve most of that. The seal I pushed back into place was the one around the outside.

With your window I too get this problem of moisture on the inside that tends to happen after a frosty night when the temperature starts rising again. I don't even bother worrying about it as the amount is so small compared to what I did have, and turning the heater on or wiping it with a cloth solves it.

With regards to your question about the drain from the seal getting blocked- I think that this is the drain either side of the car which would be by your right shoulder when you are sitting in the driver's seat. This is the main problem I had as one was blocked and the water was overflowing back onto the parcel shelf then into the boot. If you find them (It's a metal tray sort of thing with a hole in the side so you can get a socket in) and stick your finger in them they should both be dry. If there is any water standing in them then your drain is blocked.
I presumed there were technically two drains either side. The one in my photo which is rubber and part of the roof seal. And the other is higher up which is visible even with the carpet in yes? I will take pics to confirm tomorrow evening when home from work.

Will my spinning bolt be an issue?

And where exactly will my butyl tape sit? I'm still not sure where to put it.


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kjb1
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  Z3 roadster 1.9

Leak in rear which is weeting boot carpet, pooling in batter

Post by kjb1 »

Ok should i be seeing this much light in the a pillar section where the roof meets the sealing rubber?? and any ideas to remedy?

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Wookee
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Re: Leak in rear which is weeting boot carpet, pooling in ba

Post by Wookee »

Have you got any water on the seats? If not then I'd just leave it as it is as it isn't leaking.
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kjb1
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Re: Leak in rear which is weeting boot carpet, pooling in ba

Post by kjb1 »

strangely enough, no, there is no water on seats or in via there, just seems odd. Could i alter anything for a tighter fit? if do, where?


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Wookee
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Re: Leak in rear which is weeting boot carpet, pooling in ba

Post by Wookee »

I understand there is an adjustment you can make to the closing levers that brings it in tighter. I haven't had to do this so I've never looked into it. I'm sure someone more knowledgeable will be along soon.... :bow
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Robert T
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Re: Leak in rear which is weeting boot carpet, pooling in ba

Post by Robert T »

Whilst the front catches can be adjusted, this is more if you have wind noise from the front of the roof indicating it isn't being pulled tight enough against the windscreen frame.

For a gap at the side like that, I think you might be better gluing a piece of rubber to the exposed end on the windscreen side of the gap - this is frequently where water gets in when the end of this perforates allowing water out of the drainage channel into the car (you may well have seen the pic with the cable tie poking through on here) - the usual fix is to glue a piece over it - so you would be tackling both problems with this fix.

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kjb1
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Re: Leak in rear which is weeting boot carpet, pooling in ba

Post by kjb1 »

pulled catches down, and re positioned door seals, gaps now fully closed and zero leaks from here. Re-sealed with sikaflix along the windscreen seal, ( lifted rubber seal ) then ran bead right way across. Nomore leaks. I was getting bad condensation / water on my metallic front piece of the hood which tends to flake the black paint. Since doing this, it is dry as a bone come morning. Cheap fix.


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bertiejaffa
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Re: Leak in rear which is weeting boot carpet, pooling in ba

Post by bertiejaffa »

:cheers
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